That said, I can see the contemplative Hindu or Buddhist saying the exact same thing. But let us then continue this comparison to Buddhism. Origen and universalism, in general, were condemned as unorthodox at the Fifth Ecumenical Council of Constantinople (A.D. 553) . In opposition to this you may place the fruits of others and their understanding of God. Here are a couple ways: 1) Do they insist on making incorrect statements about the world as-is? There are a variety of reasons (speaking myself) that I believe while having doubt and disparaging my trust in God (Jesus) does not solve the dilemma (my own opinion) but creates more problems ( I was not raised Christian either in fact I did not become a Christian until a few years ago). And there are also periods of painful disillusionment and depression that look like withdrawal symptoms that even Christians suffer after at least partially self-Inducing and sustaining a high on Jesus for years. . Relationship is key, whether we are thinking about non-living parts of the cosmos, the living world, human-human relationships or human-divine relationships. Interesting article. As I see it, knowledge ofGod accesses different ways of knowing. You presume too much Ed. When you know something by means of such encounter, you may not be able to express it verbally, at least not in a compelling, coherent, or exhaustive manner. Certainly they are subjective but that does not then mean they cannot be compared. Why? Evidence can be internal, which whether or not you rationally elaborate upon or take the direct perceptive route nonetheless still falls into that domain. Introduction to the Old Testament; Introduction to the New Testament; Biblical Hermeneutics; Israelite History and Historiography; Hebrew Prophets; Romans in Context; Genesis in Context; Research Methods in Biblical Studies; From Conquest to Exile; Wisdom and Psalms; Science and the Bible; Torah. Magic is not real therefore magical deities are impossible. Instead, we have too many that believe theirs is the only truth, and are so confident its inerrancy, they feel compelled to enforce it in a world where evidence is really necessary to develop societal mores. Which I think is the case, but I dont want to speak for Ed. To me, simply, neither these two billion adherents nor their leaders really seem all that differentiated from their peer adherents of Allah, Brahma, and more in sacred task of transforming the world. Maybe dramatically more so? I think there are multiple reality tunnels and people make many different claims concerning their personal experiences. Beitr-ge zum internationalen Symposium vom 27. bis 29. Take sight perception as an example. Having beliefs was like always clinging tightly to something in the water to keep one afloat, always being afraid of letting go and learning to swim in the sea of faith. God means many different things to people. Differing, I believe there are grounds for excluding ones own or other faiths. One of the things Ive yet to see in Dr Enns and other Evangelicals take up of evolution is a robust address of its implications to thinking. I'm attaching my 6 page summary of Peter Enns' new book, Genesis for Normal People: Enns on Genesis.doc (55.5 KB) Dr. Enns attempts to simply explain for average Christians how many scholars read Genesis. I would take as examples of this people such as Jesus and the profound impact on the entire world for the good, that his truth has produced, and by extension, His Apostles and their experience. He has taught courses at several other institutions including Harvard University, Fuller Theological Seminary, and Princeton Theological Seminary. Some have thought it to be evasiveness. The social architecture of the church, from leadership to prayer groups, all functions along protocols and vetting systems based on doctrinal beliefs, trust-building with leaders, participation in activities, meetings and conferences, etc. I'm an author and biblical scholar. Honestly and looking ahead, my mind is more centered on the significance of the sixth extinction, climate change, the forth-coming dissipation of petroleum energy, a huge human population, limited supply of fresh water for all, and need for compassion for and collaboration with others to existentially address all this. 4 And there is none **like** unto Him. One atheist and evolutionist, Dr. Jerry Coyne, believes very strongly that evolution and Christianity are not at all compatible. Read Dr. Enns onAcademia.edu While the truth of non-material claims can not be measured, the effects of the beliefs in them can be considered and studied. The list of aspects offered doesnt quite get us to a means by which to assess exclusivity. Which then opens up the question of what reality it what knowing we are engaged in. They long to know Gods love andthereby to be filled with the very fullness of God[Ephesians 3:17-19]. What of our spiritual experiences then? None the less, I believe in Democracy and think Iron Man is awesome. Left the Ministry. Such a person in fact believes Him to exist in Parts. If this is my basis, Im as comfortable (maybe more comfortable) with a Great Spirit of native Americans as I am with a YHWH of Israel. . We go crazy in solitary confinement, when stranded on an island, when lost in the wilderness solo. Youve concisely and clearly explained the way I understand my faith and conviction in the existence of God. Usually we treat eye-witness testimonies as valid proofs of an experience, especially when they corroborate key elements of the same story (granted one can misinterpret what their senses tell them). But may I pose this: So true. There are also cases of people who were converted to Christianity after suffering drug or alcohol addiction, but later they realized Christianity was their new drug and gave that up too, and felt BETTER for having done so: Such as I would imagine the Eastern Orthodox who are known for such practice and perspective on faith. Every disciple of the kingdom of heaven is like a householder who draws out from their storage room things both old and new. Or even what the cosmos is? Over the next twelve months our focus will be "Old and New: An . The gathered Body of Christ? 1. I also would want to point out that the Christian religion has to do with a person named Jesus (as christians we believe this Jesus is still transforming lives and hes on the loose), in other words it is not just a simple have faith or belief The Christian faith is a living trust that Jesus Christ (messiah) will rescue (has will in the future) the world for a global renewal (earth and heaven). Incarceration Nation From this, I have a question for you; isnt it also completely reasonable (and rational) to look at the fruits of other peoples experience to see that their belief and faith are grounded in the truth? Peter Enns is the last person that I will analyze simply because he probably best typifies what can happen once one begins the downward spiral on adopting an evolutionary view to Scripture. M.Div. It just begs the question, which one? It may be a way of knowing, but not necessarily yielding as many as true things as possible and as few as false things as possible. 2) Do their beliefs about God or Gods or whatever bring us to harming the other or the world, or bring us to healing and redeeming? Can I find a certain kind of longing and hope to possibly be filled even on the Trump Train? Graciousness to Americans and more? That is a blessing from God. The human mind cannot think alone. Who said God is a HE? Magic is not real. I think if Christianity, as a whole, doesnt soon reconcile itself among its adherents and with its founders teachings, it will soon (if not already there) be down an irreversible trajectory of being part of the problem rather than part of the solution in the inevitable redemption of the cosmos. where Paul regards Adam's disobedience as the cause of universal sin and death from which humanity is redeemed through the obedience of Christ. Nor does it mean we cannot say anything objective about them. My point is a rather modest one: the question of Gods existence is not settledone way or the otheron the basis of the kind of evidence-based knowledge that modern western culture (rightly) embraces to help us explain many, many things around us. in being with another person expressing love in ones flesh. It was first proposed by the unorthodox church Father, Origen (ca. I said that when it comes to experiences, peoples experience of Allah or Yahweh or Jesus or Krishna or Buddha lay along a wide spectrum. Well that seems to me to be more of a way of guessing then? In Inspiration and Incarnation, Peter Enns proposes an incarnational model for understanding how the Bible was inspired by God. " The Bible - from back to front - is the story of God told from the limited point of view of real people living at a certain place and time. Peter Enns is an American theologian, author, professor, and Biblical scholar. Forced love . Tweets at @peteenns. I presume you are referring to Islam in your final sentence? Personally, I talk to God, make intercession, and he orchestrates reality beyond the sphere of my influence or capability to manipulate the results. The reason many do not talk more about these issues are beyond me (I say that knowing that many do in fact talk about these tensions Pete is one of them). Read article the other day that said they refused to accept myth as fact. Its not utopia but Ill take it. I like the fruit of this way of knowingeverything from electricity and medicine to electron-microscopesand radio telescopes. Lets not let a label lead us toward an equivocation. I suggest maybe you read your Bible again. I think it is safe to say that much of my academic journey has been a process of synthesizing these (and other) influences in my life. So Im not really sure what your point is. The good news is that those who humble themselves and say yes when He calls do experience Him in an undeniable complete way. We struggle with and within the limits of what we can come to know. Not sure what the phrase, proper locus of religious conviction means, because based on my own interactions with a wide variety of folks I have noticed that people dont have the same attraction to mystical or spiritual thinking. Many miss it here because they want to be in control of any such relationship. Peter is an Old Testament scholar (PhD, Harvard University) who currently teaches as Affiliate Faculty of Biblical Studies at Eastern University. Peter Eric Enns (born January 2, 1961) is an American Biblical scholar and theologian. Robert Anton Wilson pointed out how many people cling tightly to a single reality tunnel and dont dare to seek all the ways their tunnel overlaps with that of others. Were two thousand years in. Or Osama bin Ladin or Warren Jeffs for that matter. While specific sins against a particular God, prophet, holy book, holy place, or sacrament, are as diverse as could be. I dont think God would. Id suggest that this is even true among the authors of Scripture and with general trends by the centuries as well as across Fowlers stages of faith as well as by denomination and religion. Try the works of John Hick, former Evangelical who became a fascinating philosopher of religion and sought a common transcendental basis for them all. [pp. ~ Jackson Browne. Many dont understand that the contentions among faiths are fought (and will be won in the end) not on the grounds of being right, but on the grounds of making the world right. M As claimed, the Incarnation passed through our material and human existence. Instead it looks like people have a wide variety of reality tunnels and interpretations. But I also get that Christianity isnt really transforming the world through compassion essentially better than anything or anyone else. THIS IS CANCELLED: His main public presentation will be Saturday, February 15, at 8 p.m. in Sydnor Performance Hall, Schewel Hall, University of Lynchburg, drawing from . Even Yale was founded by some conservative ministers displeased at the growing moderation, liberalism and theological excesses as they say it, happening at Havard. apprehension uncluttered by thought I also suspect that you and Frank probably share many criticisms of your more conservative Christian pasts. Pete Enns is the Abram S. Clemens Professor of Biblical Studies at Eastern University. One of the things I wonder is how these two general groups not talk past each other. What I have noticed especially in connection with your point about knowing God outside of our default rationalism, Pete, is that both as a church and as individual Christians in the West, we find it difficult knowing how to spend time in silence, or in solitude, away from our faith projects or church systems. And I learned about the history of all these relatively young fundamentalist Christian colleges founded in the 1920s like WTS, during the fndamentalist-modernist controversy. You just need to go a little further, Peter. Dave Burbank In other words, I dont believe in God because I see no evidence for God or I believe in God because the evidence proves it are both nonsensical claims for me. Without discounting all those wonderful things, I do not think that the God question is settled this way. Im more so now in my life in the former group of people. Those are all things that can be looked at. Pete Enns critiques John Piper's recent remarks about the Jewish conquest of Canaan in the Old Testament. Across religions, the evidences are the grapes and figs. For me, I often think about thinking in this context more than either a historically analytical school or even Continental. It is no more Western and modern than the Greek-named constellations are ancient and Greek or the Arabic-named stars are Medieval and Arab. One thing that is crystal clear about Enns is that he hates rules. Really, evidence is simply a modern, western way of coming to belief or faith or knowledge? I think that if all religious believers could accept such limitations, and find in the penumbra thereof, that there is no certainty, and therefore, no grounds for believing to the exclusion of other faiths, wed find less conflict in this world. Peter Enns (Ph.D., Harvard University) is Abram S. Clemens professor of biblical studies at Eastern University in St. Davids, Pennsylvania. However, there are many Christians in our country who also want to enforce solely biblical beliefs here too. Although, both people and God can be disappointing in ways myself included. And there are child-rearing costs to and constraints concerning size of head vs. size of pelvis. Now one can doubt that the man, Peter ever lived, but there are extra-biblical references to him as being the head of the church. Here's the heart of it: 'Westminster Theological Seminary's board voted to suspend tenured professor Peter Enns last week after a two-year theological debate over his 2005 book, Inspiration and Incarnation. (Ive blogged on Benner several times, for examplehere. Enns is a frequent contributor to journals and encyclopedias and is the author of several . Their work involves moving from the phenomenon through the perceptual equipment to the physical biology that makes subjective states objectively real. On what basis is God still an option for you?. My personal thought is that 11 Peter is one of the later books of the NT; likely written circa 125-150 AD. But I also think youre using the language of evidence in a very stale, limited manner. Id suggest there are other qualitative characteristics too. Reason and sagacity cannot visualise Him. Therefore, that which is felt or known by the senses, having shape and colour, cannot be God. And I also can grok the paradoxical Essence of a Triune God, the kind of God allowing himself to be humbled and broken in kenotic sacrifice as an example of a new Way of Being, in hope of bringing forth a Kingdom. If labels have to be used, I wonder if you would identify, or at least sympathize, with igtheism, which holds that every theological position assumes too much about the concept of God. It is not when I am going to meet him, but when I am just turning away and leaving him alone, that I discover that God is. Out of curiosity may I know your position on 2nd Peter. Lese Exodus for Normal People: A Guide to the Storyand History of the Second Book of the Bible gratis von Peter Enns Verfgbar als Hrbuch Jetzt 14 Tage gratis testen. " To love as God loves means loving not just others like us, but those who are not. 'The board voted 18-9 to suspend Enns, an Old Testament professor whose book created controversy on how to interpret the . Deities that the Christian faith does not hold to exist. Thanks for posting this. read the whole Chicago Statement aloud to his cat, Marmalade. 3. Evidence used that way is a foundationalist dead end, but thats not the only way of interpreting Experience, of which scientific experiments are one kind. Every compound elements etc possesses shape and colour that attracts the senses. Peter Enns is Abram S. Clemens Professor of Biblical Studies at Eastern University, St. Davids, Pennsylvania. I have asked many people who say that they dont believe, what evidence would be sufficient for them to believe that God exists, and I think the opposite, what evidence would be sufficient to convince me that God does not exist I am committed to encouraging young Christian men and women to explore their faith by engaging Scripture, and in so doing make their faith their own and mature as followers of Christ. To me there is a sacred goodness in characteristics of the way and Christianitys wins over the centuries are attributable to this. All this is to say, I am not ready to leave the hope and realism of modernity behind yet, but if I do it wont be atheism. Im not sure the world would be a better place if more people thought like me, though do you mind if I out this on my resume? Religious conviction without evidence based knowledge is why there are so many religions, denominations, sects and cults and demonizations of one by the other. Indeed, it is a way of knowing that has been championed as part of the development of culture in the Western tradition, but to pigeon hole the method as somehow distinctively Western is to lose something about its universality in a universe that significantly appears to exhibit fundamental uniformity. The rule that clarity is the standard of truth subsequently achieved dominance in the Enlightenment (Bavinck, Reformed Dogmatics, 1 vol edition, 486). St. Davids, PA 19087-3696 Are you willing to also consider; Hindu scriptures, Muslim scriptures, Buddhist, scriptures, Taoists scriptures, etc? Why do I believe in God? Thank you Joseph. These are subjective, private experiences. You can experience a spiritual longing, connectedness, peace, transformation, serenity, boundless compassion, and so on. And we can also look at those experiences, and see if there is an element of illusion about them. I count it a great privilege to help students keep their horizons in front of them and come to know God better on their life-journey. But if he gets a response in morse, he doesnt need to empirically see whats on the other side to begin the process of knowing the other side. In fact, presuming that evidence-based knowledge is the only sure way of knowing anythingworth knowing lies behind both the angst and the sense of certainty many feel about Gods existence or non-existence. Government, College of Arts and Sciences/Public Policy, Jeb E. Brooks School of Public Policy. None can fully understand or explain His Being however hard he my try. Here's where the money is going! While some would say the orthodox Nature of God and his Oneness pertains to Being, I think most more linearly worship something that is more a manner of /a/ being than Being. I want to be like you. April 2015 am Universal-museum Joanneum in Graz (Schild von Steier, Beiheft 8 / Forschungen zur geschichtlichen Landeskunde der Steiermark 79) Archologie in sterreich 1938 1945 Danner Salzburg. He has not permitted human mind to grasp the Essence of His Being **YET** He has not prevented them from realising His Presence. Dr. Peter Enns (PhD, Harvard University) is Abram S. Clemens professor of Biblical Studies at Eastern University, St. Davids, PA. But in the formerit seemssome individuals cannot ask the does God exist? question without deeply wondering about which God?? Professor. Do you think JFK could have won with that campaign statement? Perhaps its ones urge for drinking mothers milk when one is first born (who gave you a mother? For those who hold the view that the Bible contains an ever-expanding revelation of the truth and knowledge of God from beginning to end, what is to be taken away from your article? . We know by comparing our own, internal, subjective experiences of sight that this is a largely reliable sense. Polls, Statistics and other Data Does God exist? Also try googling sea of faith.. You cannot relate to it if you dont have a little one of your own. First, let me say that I hold to the position that without faith one cannot please God His words, not mine. No- before the 70s it was safe for white little girls and boys to walk down the street correct yourself- thee was never a time in any country where there was absolute peace- even in the Bible. Why the need to respond ? Given all this and more, my personal choice is simply to continue to acknowledge Gods blessings upon my life and therefore acknowledge God. Good point. This is very simple. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Instead of humbly stating this belief as an opinion, Joker3857 blatantly says "then dont be one". He has written numerous books, including The Bible Tells Me So, The Sin of Certainty, and How the Bible Actually Works. These "ancient, ambiguous, and. Westminster Theological Seminary Ted Cruz proudly stated that any president who doesnt pray on his knees to Jesus Christ every day isnt fit to be commander-in-chief. But by putting these experiences on the table and sharing them, we can say some objective things about them. I find much of the tradition of Christianity over the last 2,000 yearsand most acutely in the generations of my life in Americato have failed what I consider to be the best centerings of the apocalyptic hope of Jesus of Nazareth. Human faculties of conception, perception and learning, and attributes of volition, intuition and apprehension cannot catch sight of His Person or fathom the extent of His Might and Glory. That instead, my friend needed to see realia like a man in a soviet prison who goes to the very cell wall and taps a message in morse. But I dont think this way of knowing settles theGod question, since it presumes that God is anelement of the cosmos that occupies space and issubject to observation and testinglike a quasar, proton, or tectonic plateswaiting to be discovered or discerned through methods by which we know the physical world. As is our collaborative aspects of the scientific method. Peter Enns does it again!' Richard Rohr, author of Falling Upward For many Christians, the Bible is a how-to manual filled with literal truths about belief that must be strictly followed. As is knowledge of Allah. The coding and operation of these systems is communicated in the sermons and recommended literature. It went something like this: Your desire to employ empiricism as a means of knowing God; you are like a person in the middle of a realm with night-vision goggles, microscopes, radar equipment, headphones and such. Peter K. Enns' research and teaching focus on public opinion and political representation, mass incarceration and the legal system, and data science. Im loosely affiliated with an international church (evangelical) in Beijing; and it is quite stark to me here how the Western mind (American in particular) shapes and engages with Christian faith. What does is look like to seek God? Such is life. . Simply, the method yields divergent knowings, perhaps even a different sin of certainty. Tweets at @peteenns. http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/01/leaving-ministry-left-ministry-polls.html. darkness, a vulnerable faith, and the normal Christian life, Spirituality and the Awakening Self: The Sacred Journey of Transformation, http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/08/christians-or-non-christians-who-suffer.html, http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2016/01/gods-mixed-messages-youth-pastor-killed.html, http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/03/on-recovering-from-alcoholism-drug.html, http://infidels.org/library/modern/ed_babinski/experience.html, http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/01/leaving-ministry-left-ministry-polls.html, http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/cruz-any-president-who-doesnt-begin-every-day-his-knees-isnt-fit-be-commander-chief-nation, http://www.al-islam.org/tradition-myrobalan-fruit-hadith-al-halila-imam-jafar-al-sadiq/hadith. Perhaps agreat offense to many of us in the modern world is thatGod is not known in the way we are used to knowing many other thingswhich is a hard pill to swallow if youre committed to evidence-based knowing as the only path forward. You can although quite innadequately (as with so many other things in life), still put them on the table. True mystics do experience God in a tangible manner that is more real than anything that could ever be experienced through the five senses although those senses may be secondarily affected. The Evolution of Adam: What the Bible does and doesn't say about human origins Jonathan Jong 2012, Theology and Science Abstract In this review, I summarize and critically evaluate Peter Enns's claim that evangelicals ought not read Genesis 13 literally. I think there is a model there where the subjective, but real experience of God is the starting point for understanding the perceptual equipment, which will help us to acknowledge the existence of a real Being that makes the subjective states or experiences real. You made some very good points. At best, such persons hopes could make an iron-age reality better. We would then be wise to doubt the veracity of our own sight. As we do for so many other experiences and perceptions deeply subjective in nature. He is a cohost of the popular podcast The Bible for. As we give exercise to examples, we often discover these characteristics are more descriptive than prescriptive in their nature. Doesnt everyone including yourself feel an urge to respond given an open forum and divergent points of view? We're raising 50k for our campaign. Pseudo-Solomon and His Scripture: Biblical Interpretation in the Wisdom of Solomon,, The Contribution of Ecclesiastes to Biblical Theology,. But it takes the work of the Spirit of God in ones life to actually believe and rely upon these evidences. This is perhaps another way to look at the sin of certainty. http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/03/on-recovering-from-alcoholism-drug.html, See also my paper the critiques the claim that the Christian experience is unique He speaks actively in academic and ecclesiastical venues on topics pertaining the Bible and Christian faith. Dr. Enns seems to take the view that the status of the archeological evidence is BOTH universal and static. But in essence our Christian hope is a trust that God will in fact be good to his word (which is trust now verifying the identity of God through science observation seems impossible but there are many things, and I say many things we cannot fully grasp by using human studies, judgments, experimentation, etc). AMA. Some people live with more uncertainty than you do. I think the wrong way of knowing Peter refers to as rational analysis possibly could be better worded as non-paradoxical., In some ways (at least today), I cant help but think the answer to the does God exist? riddle is the Zens .. Basis for my response: 2 Peter 1:15 to 2 Peter 2:2. God is just another word for magic. Professor; Executive Director, Roper Center for Public Opinion Research; Robert S. Harrison Director, Cornell Center for Social Sciences. (Isnt this another example of a way of knowing?). Yet how is this testimony for more than such kind of belief being an adaptive trait? But is that version of a Messiah a bringer of healing to all? There can be various degrees of certainty, of course. However, I tend to apply such experiences to relationships that I have with the people that surround me not to the deities of ancient cultures. Which then opens up the question of what reality it what knowing we are engaged in. Enns seeks to grow us in maturity so that we might take up wisdom. 298 . Previously he was a Senior Fellow of . To dig down a little deeper theologically, I can deeply understand the paradox of the Incarnation of not only a God-as-man, but in the form of a baby in a manager in Galilee in first century Palestine.
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